Emily Ladau === Tim Villegas: what it really comes down to for me is the fact that minority groups are just repeatedly being demonized for simply existing. Emily Ladau: as a disabled woman, I am waking up every morning to find out that. Some other subset of my rights is systematically being stripped away. And I say this as someone who is relatively privileged and lucky in the sense that I have, a safety net and a support system. I'm not going to. End up immediately unhoused if something happens. And I'm not going to end up in an institution if I need care. And I still have access to the healthcare that I need and I'm still able to, put food on the table. But the circumstances are particularly dire for the disability community, especially for people who have multiple marginalized identities. And, I am just kind of. Watching the domino effect of, how it's impacting people that I love and people that I care about And right now in this. Moment at this time in April of 2025, I am still safe, but you know, who knows what's gonna happen. Tim Villegas: Hi friends. This is Think Inclusive. I'm Tim Villegas, who you just heard was Emily Ladau, someone that I am proud to call a friend for over a decade. She is a lot of things, an activist, a writer, a speaker. Most recently she is Editor of Able News, which amplifies the perspectives of New York's diverse, vibrant disability community and serving as a resource throughout the state. But she does so much more. Thanks so much for being here with us today. We appreciate each and every one of you listening to or watching. Think Inclusive MCIE's podcast that brings you conversations with people doing the work of inclusion in the real world. And while you're here, make sure to hit the follow or subscribe button wherever you are so that you can keep think inclusive in your feed. In this episode of Think Inclusive, Emily and I discuss the challenges of securing resources and employment. For people with disabilities and emphasize the need for thoughtful communication to reach diverse audiences, including conservative politicians. We also explore effective allyship highlighting the importance of self-care and strategic advocacy. Before we get into my conversation with Emily, I want to tell you about our sponsor for this season. IXL. IXL is a fantastic all in one platform, designed for K 12 education. It helps boost student achievement, empowers teachers, and tracksprogress seamlessly. Imagine having a tool that simplifies what usually requires dozens of different resources. Well, that's IXL. As students practice, IXL adapts to their individual needs, ensuring they're both supported and challenged. Plus, each learner receives a personalized learning plan to effectively address any knowledge gaps. Interested in learning more? Visit Ixl.com/inclusive. That's Ixl.com/inclusive. Alright, after a short break, we'll get into my conversation with Emily Ladau, catch you on the other side. ​ Tim Villegas: Emily Ladau, welcome to the Think Inclusive Podcast. Emily Ladau: Thank you. I am happy to be back. Tim Villegas: Uh, Emily, what is new with you? Uh, I, I do know because I follow you on social media that you just got engaged, so congratulations. That's fantastic. Emily Ladau: Yeah, thank you. actually it's kind of wild, but next month I'll have been engaged for a year, but it still counts as just being engaged. I have been like not quite adjusting to saying fiance instead of, boyfriend yet. So it's funny. Tim Villegas: Has it really been almost a year? Oh my gosh. Well, because thing, oh my gosh. The thing is I don't Emily Ladau: post a lot on Yeah, social media. So like if you look at my social media, it's pretty high up there. So literally every time I go somewhere, people are like, you just got engaged, right? I'm like, yeah, may last year. Tim Villegas: Oh my goodness. Emily Ladau: It's so literally you and everybody else. It's really funny. but yeah, so I mean that's kind of the, the fun personal update. but in terms of everything else, it's, uh, I guess this is so cliche, but work hard, try to play hard, but mostly work hard right now. Tim Villegas: And, uh, so, and, and you are with Able Magazine, is that right? Yeah. Emily Ladau: Yes. Yeah. So I, in, gosh, it's been about a, a year or so of that now too, a year and a half, um, in. January of last year, I started with Able News and we are a monthly digital newspaper that focuses on amplifying diverse perspectives from across the disability community, offering news, op-eds features, reporting on what's impacting the disability community, and then also featuring arts culture, sports, community events, things like that. that's been kind of the, the primary gig for me right now. Okay. And I, I always like to be up to a lot of things at once, so that's only one thing. Tim Villegas: Right. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sure you have lots of other things. and then, uh, able News, is that a free resource for that anyone can access or is it a subscription or like, how does that work? Emily Ladau: So it is subscription based and it's always one of those things where it's so challenging because I know that asking people for any kind of money is. Seems a little bit difficult when you're talking about disability resources. However, the reality is that we also need to pay our writers and our writers are, primarily people with disabilities. So in order to make sure that we are providing for the people who are providing for us, we do charge a small subscription fee. It's $18 for an entire year. Of issues. Tim Villegas: Oh yeah, that's, yeah, that's fantastic. That's, you know, yeah. So it's, Emily Ladau: it's small. but I think what's so important for people to recognize is that there are incredible disabled writers who are behind this, who are doing the original reporting, who are out there going to events, getting interviews, being resources for the community. So I, I love working with our writers because they just are incredible storytellers and reporters. Tim Villegas: Great. Great. And we'll make sure to put that link in the show notes and Emily Ladau: thank you. Uh, Tim Villegas: I know, I know a lot of people are looking, especially right now for quality reporting, uh, reporting that really focuses on, a disabled perspective. So I, I think that, I think our audience would really, really find that valuable. So amazing. Did you have someone to say? I didn't wanna catch you up. Oh no, Emily Ladau: I was just gonna say, um, I think there is a hunger for that right now. Tim Villegas: yeah, Emily Ladau: I know that there is so much going on every five seconds in the news cycle and finding someone to say, here's what's happening and here's how it's going to impact the disability community is really important. And there are certainly some great resources out there. but I think that unfortunately for the disability community, it's still few and far between. Tim Villegas: Absolutely. what is on top of mind for you right now in this moment? We're recording in April, early April of 2025. and like you said, there's so much going on. There's, you know, it changes minute by minute. So, um, we're not doing any sort of breaking news here, but it's just what is, consuming your thoughts right now? Emily Ladau: Gosh, what isn't consuming my thoughts right now when I look at the cycle of everything that's happening, but I think that what it really comes down to for me is the fact that minority groups are just repeatedly being demonized for simply existing. And as a disabled woman, I am waking up every morning to find out that. Some other subset of my rights is systematically being stripped away. And I say this as someone who is relatively privileged and lucky in the sense that I have, a safety net and a support system. And I am someone who comes from, a degree of privilege in the sense that, I'm not going to. End up immediately unhoused if something happens. And I'm not going to end up in an institution if I need care. And I still have access to the healthcare that I need and I'm still able to, put food on the table. But the circumstances are particularly dire for the disability community, especially for people who have multiple marginalized identities. And, I am just kind of. Watching the domino effect of, how it's impacting people that I love and people that I care about whose, you know, savings are being wiped out and who are not sure how they're going to access the care that they need or be able to live safely in their homes and communities who are losing job opportunities. so it's, it's scary and it's dire. And right now in this. Moment at this time in April of 2025, I am still safe, but you know, who knows what's gonna happen. Tim Villegas: Yeah. uh, same. We, we, uh, mean as an organization we, uh, are. Paying attention to what's going on. And, uh, in, at least in Maryland, you know, our funding has not been,has not been in jeopardy, yet, so there's always that yet. but we've, you know, we've had to make some decisions, about certain things. So, and that's, that's really, really difficult. You and I are just two people, right? Like we're talking about millions of people in our country that are making those decisions every single day and figuring out what to do. so it's a really, it's a really difficult time right now. and, I'm wondering about just the. Like the disability community in general, like what are, do you have any sort of story or example of, uh, of something, of someone that's close to you that has been really affected by what's going on? I know this is this is a, uh. I'm putting you on the spot, so if you don't that's fine. We can cut this. But you know, if anything comes to mind. Yeah. Emily Ladau: You know, I mean there are so many people who I know already who have lost their jobs and, In particular jobs that pertain to accessibility and to, diversity, equity, and inclusion initiatives. And, so many people who are doing great work in. The federal government to ensure that the legislation that has been put in place to protect the rights of people with disabilities was actually upheld and implemented are the people whose jobs have already been taken away. And even just on a personal level, it's impacted, work opportunities for me and it's. Definitely, become a, a game almost of, how do I say that? I'm working on diversity, equity, inclusion, and accessibility without actually using any of those words. And so again, it seems like a minor thing, but you know, so many people who have poured their hearts, their souls and their lives into this are now. scrambling to find employment. you know, it's not even just an example of one person. It's so many people that I know, who have been doing amazing work to protect the rights of the disability community. And now every day that I'm on LinkedIn, I see that these amazing people are, looking for work and that, that hurts my heart for sure. Tim Villegas: Yeah. organizations and corporations are in a very tough spot because you have these executive orders coming out from the Trump administration, you know, targeting the these DEI initiatives, right? But it's so vague. It's like, I think I was reading something in the Chronicle, Phil Philanthropy. And it was something about the str the, they call it, they called it strategic vagueness. And I thought that was really interesting because, everything that I've seen is this,very, it seems to me intentional, vagueness and it causes a lot of confusion and chaos. Everyone's like, well, what do I do? Like, how do we go forward? And so a lot of people are just making decisions, uh, about certain things and not really knowing how things will affect it, but, but have made decisions in advance. Right. and that's what is so kind of upsetting to me is, All these people's lives are being, millions of people's lives are being impacted. but we, we don't, we haven't even seen the full impact because some of the, some of these, um, programs that, that are being, you know, slashed, some judges are saying, oh, You know that you gotta rehire them or or the administration is saying, oops, we didn't mean to do that. Or, you know, so it's like, does anyone know what's going on? I don't think so. Emily Ladau: And I think that the phrase strategic vagueness really resonates on the other side too, because if they are being strategically vague about what we can and cannot say, then the flip side of that is. A lot of what I am doing is dealing in strategic vagueness, because if I'm not allowed to say accessibility, but I still mean accessibility, then I'm gonna talk about how technology needs to be usable for everyone. And if I'm not allowed to say inclusion, then I'm going to say. celebrating everyone in our community. Right. And it, it means the same thing, but Right. Yeah. If we have to play the game right now, I'm playing the game. I don't want to, I don't like it. But that's what it's coming down to is basically wordsmithing. Yeah. To figure out what is okay to say, even though at the end of the day, we still mean what we were saying before all this was happening. Tim Villegas: Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. do you mind if I bring up something you, you posted on Facebook, about, I'm not, I don't have it in front of me, so it, is it Representative Crockett? Is that right? Emily Ladau: Yes. Tim Villegas: In Texas. And was it, um. Texas. Emily Ladau: Yeah. So, basically the short version of the story is Uhhuh that, representative Crockett was talking at a human rights campaign dinner about Governor Abbott in Texas. And Governor Abbott is a wheelchair user and she referred to him as Hot Wheels mm-hmm. And called him a hot mess, and it created quite the little tizzy. Tim Villegas: Yeah. Yeah, it's quite a little tizzy because, uh, you know, if you're a wheelchair user and someone tells you that, you're, that you have hot wheels, right? It's, it, it's not taken too kindly. Emily Ladau: You know, it's such a, an interesting conversation because on the one hand, I. I'm truly kind of unbothered and I think it's sort of the most tame possible thing that you can say. And I am certainly no friend or fan of, anyone who's, just going along with the current administration. So I don't particularly worry about how Governor Abbott feels about all of this, but what I was concerned about is. We have so much going on right now. Don't give people who are already trying to systematically strip our rights away. Anything else to work with? Yeah, when it comes to the language that we use, that was really what my feelings came down to. I don't think saying Hot Wheels is so deeply offensive in the grand scheme of things. It's not. I think that what's more important is that we're being thoughtful about our language because we want to make sure that under the umbrella of people who accept. People with disabilities that we do in fact show that we accept people with disabilities. But at the same time, representative Crockett is a black woman and there were plenty of people who gleefully looked at it as an opportunity to go after her. And so there were clear undertones of racism there, even as we were absolutely asking her to be mindful of her language. And so it's a very nuanced and complicated conversation, but what it comes down to for me is words matter. But intent and impact also matters, and it also matters how we are responding. Tim Villegas: Absolutely. nuanced conversations, we love them around here. so I, that's why I wanted to bring it up because it reminds, it just reminds me of all the times during the, you know, Trump, I, 1.0. a lot of people, you know, were a attacking, you know, his IQ or you know, all these different ways to, demean his intelligence. You know, and I know that that is so such par for the course. Everyone seems to do it on social media. Um. And it's just part of the ver unfortunately, the vernacular of, uh, of the insults that are going around. But it really just, it really just hurts any sort of, legitimate. criticism of,Trump one or 2.0. when you are, luring yourself to, to say those things. It's, it also happened with, the Biden administration. Emily Ladau: It's lazy criticism, in my opinion. It in no way actually gets to the heart of what is so problematic. It is instead using disability as an insult and. Sending a terrible message to people who have cognitive and intellectual and learning disabilities in the process, and it is just as easy to say that someone is a bad person. So why do we need to resort to saying that someone has a low IQ or that someone is dumb or that someone is stupid when we could easily say they are bad? Because to have a cognitive disability does not make you a bad person. And I think that we are so just careless with our language and I know. A lot of people say to me that I am too weighed down in all of the talk of words mattering and that we have much bigger issues going on because the world is on fire. So stop caring if someone says that Trump is dumb or has a low iq. But you know what? I care very deeply because the reality is that. We get further and further into the mess when we start devaluing and dehumanizing people who don't deserve to be dehumanized. And it's very simple to just work on changing our mindset. So when we mean that someone is a bad person, we say that they're a bad person and we don't say that they have a low iq. Tim Villegas: and you also, I, I think I'm very, I'm very much am where you are with words. and their meaning and their intent. And I feel like, as, especially as someone who thinks about communication all the time, and that's the. You have to draw a line somewhere. You know, you have to say, this is not okay. Like, I don't care if you disagree with this person or if you, even if you like, have all these emotions and you hate this person, you still don't say certain things. And, otherwise you are, you're just like, you're just like anybody else, you know, like what's gonna set you apart as a communicator, saying all those things, aren't it? It's not gonna convince somebody to change their mind. I don't think I've ever, I, I mean that, I can't think of one example where the, That happened. Emily Ladau: Yeah, because it doesn't, it just, you know, feeds into, the chaos and the media frenzy without actually contributing anything meaningful to the conversation and. The important thing for me to point out also is that I am not a fan of double standards. And so if we're going to hold one person to account, then we need to hold everyone to account. And by holding someone to account, I do not mean being a vicious, I. Or racist attacker because you don't like what someone says. I mean saying, let's be mindful and let's do better. And that's applicable to everybody. and there's a difference in how a lot of people were responding to Representative Crockett in the sense that some people were just using it as an excuse to attack her as a person. And what I wanted to do was say, here's a learning opportunity. And I think that's where the distinction lies. And then the other thing. To keep in mind is this is a problem regardless of what side of the aisle somebody is on, and people do not like when I bring this up, but back in, gosh, like 2009, maybe President Obama was on the Tonight Show with Jay Leno. And they were talking about bowling, and he was like, I bowled a 1 29. And you know, Jay Leno was like, oh wow, you know, that's so good. And it's not, it's a terrible bowling score. But you know, president Obama was like, yeah, I bowl like I'm in the Special Olympics or something. Oh no. Tim Villegas: And yeah, Emily Ladau: no. Yeah. And oh Tim Villegas: no. Oh my gosh. I think Emily Ladau: that got real buried real fast. People just like tried to bury that. the sources are there. If you Google President Obama, especially Olympics, come and it will come up on all of the legitimate news sources. And I think that in and of itself is a reminder that I will get mad at you regardless of how much I agree with your Tim Villegas: political views. Oh my gosh. Exactly. Oh my goodness. I think that's a good reminder. It's a good reminder. I think we all need to, step back and think about. Think about that. so tha yeah, thanks for indulging with that conversation. yeah, of course. What about, as you are surveying what's going on, is there anything that gives you hope? as we're in this really difficult space. Emily Ladau: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I wouldn't call myself an optimist right now, unfortunately. I would say I'm more of a realist, but you know, in terms of what I have witnessed, there are so many incredible activists who, despite being just. Pelted with the horrors of what is happening every day. Continue to show up and find ways to get their messages across. And I think that social media for all of the. Negatives about it has remained a beautiful thing because it's where I see people who are continuing to show up and it's where I see people who are continuing to advocate and educate and get their message across. And I don't think we can, Overstate the importance of that right now. So I feel hopeful every time I open up Instagram and luckily have trained the algorithm enough that I still see people who are speaking up, who are advocating, who are, you know, getting out there and making a difference and. If I think about it long enough, I get sad because I realize that not everybody's algorithm looks like mine. Of course. so I worry about being in an echo chamber. Mm-hmm. But I also know that these are the people who aren't just doing it on social media, they are doing it in their day-to-day lives. They are speaking up wherever they can. Um, they're, doing little acts of rebellion wherever they can. And I have to hold on to hope that. We are just going to keep up that fight even though we shouldn't have to. But I do feel hopeful every time I see people who are still pushing back even in the face of everything. Tim Villegas: Yeah. Yeah. I remember when I was a teacher, this was when I was first, I first started Think Inclusive as a blog, and podcast, and this was probably 2000. 2016, no. right before Trump was elected and I, you know, I was still employed by a school district, and I wrote a blog post and like up, and until that point, you know, I started really being like online. when you first get online, you're like, I don't know, like what I'm doing. I'm just gonna write stuff and like, be on social media or whatever. And, um, and I had a cause and, you know, promoting inclusive education and, I wrote a, a post about how, Donald Trump was bad for people with disabilities. Like full stop. Like it's just, it's bad. And, um, like you shouldn't, you shouldn't vote for him. and I took a stand and I remember the absolute pushback I got from, you know, like in the comments section and emails and on social media, because I had never taken any sort of political stance because. it was kind of like out of my wheelhouse. Like I'm, I wasn't used to putting my, feet into any of that before. And plus I felt like I was a public school employee and, I don't know. I, I know people still feel like, well, if I work for a school district, I can't be political, which is not true. but I know people feel that way and they're, you know, they're worried for their job and I. But I am, and so since that point, I've always been really careful about how much of what I really put out there. I've been more mindful, right? and even with my job here, it's always been like, trying to have a balance. because I don't, like if I'm per, if I'm saying something on my personal page, I'm not representing the organization at, you know, because we are nonpartisan. But this time around. Emily, I'm just like, I have no choice. I have no choice but to just completely lay it all out there. Like I almost feel, regret for not doing it sooner. You know what I mean? not that my voice would necessarily have tipped any sort of balance, but, 'cause we were, I mean, I was having these conversations with people and like you. Internally we're trying to figure out like, you know, what do we do? How do we respond and stuff. so I don't know if that's, if that resonates with you at all Emily Ladau: deeply. And I always say that when I am speaking for myself because I don't represent the whole of the disability community and this. Message was something that I was sharing long before I was being more vocal about my views. I would say, if you've met one disabled person, you've met one disabled person. And that is not my saying, you know, that is something that many people with different types of disabilities have been saying for years. But it's a reminder that I share because I want people to understand that no matter what, there's no way that I can speak for a population of a billion plus people. Mm-hmm. That being said, When I see that that population of a billion plus people is so deeply at risk, I feel like I have to say something. And even though what I'm saying is only representative of my own views, I am concerned for the whole of a community at this point. And. I worry at some point that something that I say is going to come back in a way that ultimately harms me, but at least I will know that I have stayed true to myself and it's a scary thing, but at the same time. What you said is, is very true about being mindful about how you're putting yourself out there, and I am very thoughtful about every single word that I put out there because I know that I. At the end of the day, I could easily alienate the same people who I am trying very, very hard to win back over. And so if I can just find a way to toe the line, some people think, oh, well, you're just pandering to people. No, no, I, it's not about pandering anymore. You know, it's about how can I communicate in a way that discusses the seriousness of what's going on. While also maybe not alienating people who I really need to reign back in. And, it's a, a constant balance that I'm trying to figure out. But, you know, when my book came out, for example, um, there were plenty of people who were like, this is ridiculous. You just wrote this to a non-disabled audience and You clearly don't actually care about the disability community because you're, again, pandering to them. And now I, I have to laugh because it's like, no, I'm not, this is where we are. This is the kind of communication that we need to be doing right now. We need to be thinking about every single word that we say and how it is going to land with people. So, yeah, it's, it's such a, a, a dance really. Tim Villegas: It is a dance. It is a dance. Um, and that re that, reminds me of something. So we were, I was, I was down covering a story. I live in Georgia, you know that, but just as a reminder, if anyone doesn't know, I live in, uh, the Atlanta metro area. And I, I went down to the Georgia State Capitol to, cover a story of a, a parent who has been advocating with their state senator, for, for inclusive practices. And so I went down and, I was in the conversation and listening and, and taking notes and all that stuff. and I was surprised at. how the state senator had no clue that a family, with a, a child with a disability could go to an IEP and the school district say, sorry, we can't serve your child in your neighborhood school. They have to go five, 10 miles down the road to, practically across the city to another school, to serve them because we don't. We don't teach those kids in this school. had no clue, zero clue that had, that happens. And it, it's like, and so what I was telling him, The senator was, I'm like, yeah, that's just, that's, this is just one story. Like you, you think about there's, you know, hun, there's over a hundred counties, I think, in Georgia. Like it happens every, everywhere. Every state, every city, every county that this is a very, very common story. And this, senator happened to be a republican, a conservative, and. they were appalled because it's a parent's rights issue, and so it made me think, I'm like, I wonder if, because you talked about pandering. I'm like, I wonder if there's a way to communicate certain ideas, That really, take into consideration the values and the, the issues that are most on top, on top of mind for. Conservatives, Yeah. and make them care about something, you know what I mean? there's something there. I'm not exactly sure, how to do that, but I, I, I was reminded that, every time I've said this to somebody, I. And they're of a parti particular political persuasion. It completely infuriates them. And I'm like, wow, I guess I should be talking about this more often. Emily Ladau: Yeah, I mean, that is the perfect case in point for what I am talking about. I am a passionate believer in disability rights and justice, and I also know that if you go into, Any conservative politician's office and start talking about ableism and disability rights and justice, you're gonna lose them so fast. They will show you the door before you even sat at the table. And I hate that. And I also know that that's the reality. So if you are talking to a certain group. Know your audience, and that is perhaps the best skill that I have learned in my years in communications and advocacy is know your audience because it is one thing to use certain language. In the bubbles that you are in. And it is another thing entirely to communicate with people who are not existing day to day in those bubbles. And if you want to bring them into your cause instead of alienating them, you might need to do things that feel like pandering. Tim Villegas: Yeah. Yeah. I don't, I do want, like I know that you wouldn't necessarily characterize. That is pandering. And so I wonder if we can reframe it and say you're really communicating to somebody at their like core, at their core values, like trying to get, trying to find common ground because it like Sure. Again, it's something that I am passionate about, this is wrong. Like you should not have to send your child, across the city to another school to be educated. Like full stop. It shouldn't happen. It happens all the time. the law even like allows it basically because, whatever we can get, you know, that's another podcast episode, but, um, like it shouldn't happen. but just bringing that up. To somebody that also would care about that, I think is, a way to build common ground. And I think we need way more of that. Way more of that. Emily Ladau: Oh yeah. I always say it's about meeting people where they're at, not where you are at, but where they're at. Tim Villegas: Yes, exactly. Exactly. Emily Ladau: what advice would you Tim Villegas: give, People who wanna be allies right now, like, uh, again, you know this, our audience is mostly educators. we do have, disabled advocates and activists that listen, and we also have parents who have children with disabilities. but do you have any general advice for, for allies? Emily Ladau: Figure out what is within your capacity to do right now and do that. The weight of all of this is on no single person shoulders, but if you have the capacity to make a phone call. To your elected officials, if you have the capacity to use one of those pre-written email templates and send out an email if you have the capacity to post on social media, or maybe one day you don't have the capacity, and all you need to do is just take a break, do what you need to do to take care of yourself, and the work is gonna be here when you're ready. That doesn't mean ignore the work, it just means take care of you. And then the next day, if you feel like you can send that email, make that phone call, show up to that protest post on social media, whatever it is you feel you can do, do that. Tim Villegas: Awesome. Thanks. Thank you for that. And, you know, thank you for being here and chatting about communications. I think that that's really like it. I don't know about you, I think we're biased or I'm biased, but communications is like the thing. Emily Ladau: I'm right there with you on the bias. I mean, considering that I have devoted my life to strategic communications at this point, yes. I think communication is the thing. Tim Villegas: Yeah, I think that's a big reason why we're here where we are is it's messaging and communication. Absolutely. Um. All right. So I like to end, our episodes with a mystery question. And,these ones, most recently are written by my 12-year-old daughter Imogen. And, uh, she is, Our biggest fan, she listens to almost every episode. uh, here we go. This is just something from, 12, a 12-year-old mind. Here we go. So, um, what is your go-to karaoke song? There we go. Oh Emily Ladau: gosh. Good question. I love that. Good question. I am trying to think of what I am most likely to belt out in the car, and at the moment it is the. Version of It's My Life from the Broadway show and Juliet. Tim Villegas: Oh yeah. That's great. That's great. Yes. it's my, so who, what, who's the, um, Emily Ladau: uh, Bonjovi Tim Villegas: Bon? I don't know that I would call that my Emily Ladau: GoTo karaoke con, but if I'm in the car, I will sing it extremely loudly. So I suppose it's my, um, car karaoke song. Tim Villegas: what's that one? oh gosh, I'm gonna have to look it up. it's one that my wife and I sing all the time. It's that bright eye song. Hold on. total Eclipse of the heart. There we go. By Oh, of Tyler. Yes, yes, of course. yeah, I'm not like a huge karaoke person. Like I, I, it's not my favorite thing to do, but I'll usually, if there's a chance to do like a duet. I'm fine with that. Emily Ladau: Oh, yeah. Well, and I don't know, it sounds like your daughter might be saying she wants you to lean into the karaoke a little. So Tim Villegas: I know, I wonder what hers, you know, she's been listening to a lot of, uh. Gracie Abrams, have you ever heard of Gracie Abrams? Emily Ladau: I think I know maybe one song. Tim Villegas: Okay. Yeah, it's like my whole family loves Gracie Abrams right now. I mean, everyone loves Taylor, right? But I guess, Gracie went on tour with her or something and so now it's all, and then, she's JJ Abrams' daughter, which again is like wild to me, like where, how things happen or whatever. Yeah. But anyways, yeah. So that's. Some of her favorite music, so I get to listen to that. Emily Ladau: Well, that's a, a fun way to wrap up. Tim Villegas: Emily Ladau, thank you so much for being on the Think Inclusive podcast. It. Emily Ladau: Loved being here. Thank you for having me. That's all the time we have for this episode of Think Inclusive. Now, let's roll the credits. Think Inclusive is brought to you by me, Tim Villegas. I handle the writing, editing, design, mixing and mastering. This podcast is a proud production of the Maryland Coalition for Inclusive Education. Our original music is by Miles Kredich, with additional tunes by Melod.ie. A big shout out to our sponsor, IXL. Check them out at ixl.com/inclusive. We truly appreciate each and every one of you who tunes in. We'd love to hear how your using our episodes. Are they part of your teaching toolkit? Are you sharing them with school administrators? Drop me a line at tvillegas@mcie.org That's T-V-I-L-L-E-G-A-S@mcie.org and let me know. And hey, if you're still with us this far into the episode, it probably means you love, think inclusive and the work MCIE is. Doing. Can I ask a small favor? Help us keep the momentum going by donating at our website mcie.org. Just click the button at the top of the site and chip in $5, $10, $20. It would mean the world to us and the children in the schools and districts we partner with. Thanks so much for your time and attention and remember, inclusion always works. ​