Empowering Inclusive Education with Amanda Morin ~ 607

Amanda Morin:
Hi, I’m Amanda, and you’re listening to the podcast.

Tim Villegas:
Recording from my office in beautiful Marietta, Georgia, you are listening to the Think Inclusive Podcast, Episode 22. Today we have Amanda Morin from the National Center for Learning Disabilities and the amazing online resource Understood.org. We talk about the transition back to school for students with disabilities. We also discuss strategies parents can use during IEP meetings when it is recommended for their child to move to a more restrictive setting.

After the podcast, please visit patreon.com/thinkinclusivepodcast where you can support our goal to bring you in-depth interviews with inclusive education and community advocacy thought leaders. Also, you can help other people find us by giving us a five-star review on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to the Think Inclusive Podcast.

So without further ado, here is the interview.

Hello everyone. Thank you for listening to the Think Inclusive Podcast. Today we have Amanda Morin from the National Center on Learning Disabilities and Understood.org. She is a parent and former teacher/early intervention specialist turned education writer and advocate. She currently serves as an expert and the Content Development Manager for the National Center for Learning Disabilities, primarily on the Understood.org program, but also on a new educator initiative as well. She is the author of three books: The Everything Parent’s Guide to Special Education, The Everything Kids’ Learning Activities Book, and On-the-Go Fun for Kids: More Than 250 Activities to Keep Little Ones Busy and Happy Anytime, Anywhere. Thank you for being on the podcast, Amanda.

Amanda Morin:
Thanks for having me. It’s a big promise, isn’t it? “Anytime, anywhere, keep them happy.” That’s a big promise.

Tim Villegas:
It is. I’m sure the content delivers though.

Amanda Morin:
Well, thank you. I hope it does.

Tim Villegas:
This is great. We were just talking before we started recording that you and I have never actually talked before, but I’ve been familiar with all of your tweets and content for a long time now. I can’t even remember how long.

Amanda Morin:
Same here. I feel like we’ve traveled in the same circles forever, and this is so exciting to actually talk. I just realized I didn’t know what your voice sounded like, but I felt like I knew you already. Isn’t that such a strange feeling?

Tim Villegas:
Yeah, it is. Likewise. So I guess, what, if anything, are you working on right now? I know that you’ve written books, I know that you’re working on Understood. Is there anything else?

Amanda Morin:
Sure. So you mentioned briefly that I work for the National Center for Learning Disabilities, and Understood.org is one of our programs. It’s designed specifically for parents of kids with learning and attention issues, which encompasses learning disabilities, ADHD, and other struggling learner kinds of things.

I’m splitting my time now between that and a new educator initiative, which I’m super excited about. We’re looking at providing resources, information, and support for general educators in the classroom who are working with kids with disabilities. We know that kids are in their classrooms—hopefully all the time, hopefully close to 75% of the time—so we want to make sure teachers have practical and actionable tools to make that work really well.

That project is going to have a beta launch in January and should be fully expanded by next June. It’s been a year and a half of research and just exciting stuff. I’m excited about it.

Tim Villegas:
That’s fantastic. Is there any plan on how you’re going to let teachers know about this resource?

Amanda Morin:
Definitely. One of the things we’ve been doing is leveraging the social media presence of Understood and the National Center for Learning Disabilities. We’re also working with multiple organizations and people like you in this field to make sure you can share it with the people who really need the resources.

The neat thing is we’re looking at making it free. That’s such a huge thing for teachers. Having been a former teacher—I’m a recovering teacher, I don’t know what you would call that—free is huge. You’re spending a lot of your own money and emotional investment in getting the right things for the kids in your classroom. They’re your kids, no matter whose kids they are.

We’re certainly going to let people know as soon as we have the beta launch in January. We’ll make sure it’s tweeted out, shared via email, newsletters—all those kinds of things. It’s an exciting project. Working on both sides and seeing how parents and teachers can work together is really exciting to me.

Tim Villegas:
Great. Now, I heard you say you’re a “recovering teacher.” That’s an interesting phrase. How long were you a classroom teacher?

Amanda Morin:
I was a classroom teacher for 10 years. Then I transitioned to working with parents and kids together in the early intervention space. I worked for the Department of Education in my state, and it was in private settings because I would go into kids’ homes. When you work with younger kids, you’re in their environment because that’s where they need to be learning. That was a lot of fun. I miss it.

Tim Villegas:
Well, now you get to support education in a different way, so that’s good. Would you say that, as an educator, you felt frustrated? That’s what I’m picking up from the “recovering” part. Am I reading that right?

Amanda Morin:
I think there are always frustrations in being a teacher. For me, I wanted to spend more time working with the kids—more teaching and less paperwork. But the “recovering” part is more about missing the classroom. I still feel connected to it. I write books for parents about education, I write about education, so I’m teaching in a different realm. My kids would probably say I teach too much at home too. But I’ll never stop feeling connected to the classroom.

Tim Villegas:
I like that. That puts a more positive spin on it. Depending on when you’re listening to this, it’s back-to-school time. We have a lot of kids transitioning back into school. For instance, in my district, we’re already back in school. It’s a two-month summer, but we get breaks throughout the year, which I personally like.

What advice can you give to parents on preparing their children—really, with or without disabilities—for going back to school and making that transition?

Amanda Morin:
That’s such a big question. One of the most important things to me is not to downplay their anxieties. That might sound counterintuitive, but when we really take the time to listen to what kids are worried about, we can help them figure out ways to work around it. Listening to kids’ anxieties can help parents reset their own anxieties.

I try really hard in my house not to project my worries onto my kids. I don’t ask, “Are you worried about meeting a new teacher?” because that’s my worry. I try to listen to them. It’s also important to acknowledge your own anxieties, especially if your child has an IEP or a 504 plan.

I have three kids, two of whom have IEPs. We do this year after year, and I always get nervous that someone won’t have read their IEP or know their accommodations. I don’t want to come across as confrontational or difficult, so I try to bridge that connection with the teacher in a way that says, “Let me help you, because this will benefit everyone.”

Sometimes it’s just a matter of sending a quick email: “Hey, do you have any questions about the IEP? Anything I can answer about my child?” I also recommend that parents sit down with their kids and write an introduction letter to their teachers. They don’t even have to send it—it just helps kids think about how to talk about themselves to their teachers. And it helps parents sort through what’s important at the beginning of the year.

Tim Villegas:
I like that. When I was a classroom teacher, I really appreciated parents who were open and said, “I want you to know about my child because they are my world.” You can do that without coming across as aggressive. I love the intro letter idea. That’s really great.

Amanda Morin:
I think the important thing is to presume good intention from the very beginning. It’s hard when you’ve spent a lot of time making sure your child has the supports they need. It can be hard to trust that others have good intentions too. But we’re all working toward the same thing: helping a child be successful and thrive.

So I always try to reset and say, “Okay, I’m presuming good intention.” Maybe a question I heard came from a place I don’t understand. I try to think about the teacher’s position or the other parent’s position and respond in a way that shows I understand they’re trying hard and want the same thing I do.

Tim Villegas:
I like that idea of presuming good intentions. It’s kind of like presuming competence, which is something we talk about a lot in the inclusive education world. We presume that students can learn and succeed. So it makes sense to come into a new school year with that same attitude.

Amanda Morin:
They do connect for me. It’s about keeping everyone accountable to high expectations. If you presume competence, you believe the child can meet those expectations. If you presume good intent, you believe everyone around them is working toward the same goal.

Tim Villegas:
Right. And to further connect these, the more I think about it, I really like the way this meshes. When you have a student who already thinks the teacher doesn’t like them, doesn’t think they can learn, and is already on bad footing to start the year, that student is not going to do well. Their behavior is going to change—challenging behavior will crop up, and there will be barriers to learning.

Something I tell the teachers I work with, especially at the beginning of the year, is: get to know your students. That seems pretty obvious, right? But I think a lot of educators know there’s a lot to cover and want to get into standards right away. My advice is: you really have to know who your kids are so you can get to the standards. You have to know what their loves are, what they’re passionate about, and follow their lead at the beginning. That way, you can develop that rapport. If you invest that time, by the time you’re two or three weeks in, they’re going to trust you.

Amanda Morin:
That connection is huge, isn’t it? One of my sons is the kind of kid you definitely have to connect with before you’ve gained his trust. That’s just who he is. The teachers who haven’t had as easy a time with him over the years are the ones who didn’t take the time to see who he is or ask him who he is.

He has a ridiculous sense of humor. He’s a punster—we do a lot of punning in our house, which is ridiculous and fun. If you know that about him and you engage with his sense of humor, then he’s in your hands for the rest of the year. He’s your best student. But if you don’t do that, if you don’t get to know him, he’s going to be a challenge. And I don’t mean a challenge in the sense that he needs to be out of your classroom. I just mean it’s going to be challenging.

Amanda Morin:
When I taught, I always made sure my first contact with parents was a positive one. I never wanted the first contact to be a call that says, “So we’ve had a problem.” I always wanted it to be, “Hi, I’m Mrs. Morin, and I’m going to be your child’s teacher this year. Is there anything you want to tell me? Anything you want to ask me?” That way, the first time you hear something, it’s not panic. Because it causes panic when you get a call and you don’t know what’s happening.

Tim Villegas:
Exactly. Something else I wanted to talk about is that we have some families transitioning back to school whose students are included for a portion or the majority of the day in a co-taught setting. But then they also get pulled into a small group room or a special day class—however you want to say it. I know there are different ways to say it around the country.

Some parents may be concerned that as their child gets older, the school district or school will say, “This content is getting too hard. Your child is not going to do as well as we go forward into fourth, fifth, sixth grade. We really need to look at a more restrictive environment.” I know that’s on the minds of parents as they go back to school.

Do you have any advice for parents as they prepare for those conversations and the new school year?

Amanda Morin:
Yeah, those are scary conversations. I think they’re in the back of the minds of so many parents. They’re in the back of my mind a lot of the time.

One thing I always tell parents is to stick with asking about what’s happening now. What’s the data that shows this isn’t going to work or hasn’t been working? Honestly, if it’s working—if the supports in place are working, if your child is succeeding and meeting goals in the current setting—then predicting the future from that isn’t really possible.

There has to be some evidence showing that the child needs to be moved to a more restrictive environment. It’s really important for parents to know they can absolutely ask, “What data do you have that shows this isn’t working?”

Amanda Morin:
The next question is, “What can we change in the present setting to try and make it work before we move to a more restrictive setting?” And to that point, it’s really important for parents to understand the idea of Least Restrictive Environment.

Least Restrictive Environment is in the law—the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA). It says that students should be educated in the least restrictive environment possible, which means they should be in a general education setting with their same-age peers as much as possible, with the support they need.

Any setting outside of that is more restrictive. So if there are supports that can be put in place and your child can still succeed in that setting, that’s the first thing to go to.

A lot of parents are nervous about speaking up, even when they know that. It feels confrontational to say, “I know the law says my child deserves to be in the least restrictive environment.” But it’s really not confrontational—it’s just being informed, being assertive, and showing that you’re willing to work with the team to figure out what other supports might help keep your child in the environment they’re in.

Tim Villegas:
Yeah. I love the suggestions. I think you’re right on when you’re talking about data, because data is emotionless, right? It doesn’t have any baggage. So when you say, “This is how my child was doing last year,” and ask, “Why would we make that change to a more restrictive environment when they haven’t shown that they’re not able to perform or excel at the same rate as the year before?”—that’s a powerful question.

And to that point, let’s say they aren’t performing or excelling or achieving at the same rate. Then why is that? Because they were last year. So I think you’re right—that the data question and asking why is key.

Amanda Morin:
I think, too, at the beginning of the year, it’s really important to keep in mind that it’s the beginning of the year. I know you know what I’m talking about when it comes to data—the first three weeks of school are not as accurate as the next six weeks. What you’re looking at is that adjustment period.

For some kids, it’s actually a honeymoon period where you don’t see some of the things that might show up later. For other kids, it might be a rough adjustment. So I think it’s important not only to look at data but also at how much data you have. It’s not just, “Well, these two weeks have been difficult,” but rather, “Across time, here are the things we’re seeing consistently.” That’s really important.

Tim Villegas:
Right. Exactly. That’s great advice. So let me ask—you can put on your educator hat, your recovering educator hat—and we get a lot of questions from educators who are in districts where inclusive education just isn’t a big priority. They ask, “How can I turn things around in my district? Who do I talk to? What do I do to promote inclusive practices?”

Do you have any strategies or ideas for educators listening to this conversation?

Amanda Morin:
First, I just want to applaud educators who are asking that question. It’s a great question, and it shows that you’re really involved and ready to make a difference.

There are a couple of things. First, make your own classroom as inclusive as you can. You’re changing your classroom to reflect your expectations and philosophies.

Second, acknowledge the systems in which you work. Sometimes they can be frustrating. But make sure you have a good relationship with the special education teachers and the paraprofessionals who are there to support you. Ask about co-teaching strategies instead of pulling kids out. Ask, “How can we do this in the classroom?” That’s always a great question to ask—and to bring up in an IEP meeting as well.

Amanda Morin:
Not just privately, but in front of everyone. Ask, “Are there ways we can do this in the classroom? What can I do to support that? Who’s here who can support me in doing that?”

Also, bringing parents into the conversation can be really helpful. If you have parents who believe in inclusion and really want it to happen, they can start a drive from the outside, if you will. That ability for parents to speak to administration—whether it’s superintendents or school boards—and say, “This is really important to us,” supports you as a teacher.

I’m not suggesting an uprising, but I am saying that if you have parents who believe in this, they can bring in all the information they have.

Amanda Morin:
It’s funny—you and I both know Nicole Eredics, who wrote the book Inclusion in Action. I think it’s a fantastic book for teachers to read. It gives practical strategies—literally called “practical strategies”—to start adopting inclusive practices in your classroom.

We’re actually doing a book club through Understood.org, and it’s one of the books we’re reading. We’re having users talk to Nicole and engage with the content. It’s a great resource for teachers and for parents.

I think finding at least one more teacher who shares your belief can make you feel less alone. Whether it’s through a site like Think Inclusive, this podcast, or a local community, it doesn’t matter where that support comes from at first. It’s important to know that there are other people trying this too—and maybe hitting the same obstacles.

Tim Villegas:
Yes, that’s exactly what turned me around. In my teaching credential program, it was very inclusive. The strategies and assumptions were that you’d be supporting students in settings with typically developing kids.

But when I got my first job, it wasn’t that. I worked in a self-contained special education classroom. Knowing all the information I had, I was at a complete loss. How do I make what I know is best practice work for my kids?

That was really the impetus for why I started the website—because I didn’t know. I didn’t know what I didn’t know.

Tim Villegas:
And if you don’t know what you don’t know, you find people who know what you need to know, right?

Amanda Morin:
Exactly. And it’s so encouraging to find other people who think like you do. Then you realize, “Oh, I’m not alone,” and we can all work on this bigger idea together.

Tim Villegas:
I also want to encourage other self-contained classroom teachers—because I don’t think you know this, Amanda—but I taught for 13 years in the classroom, all of which were in self-contained settings.

Amanda Morin:
I didn’t know that. Wow.

Tim Villegas:
Yes. And I remember having conversations with certain people in our community, and they’d ask, “Why are you still there?” And I’d say, “I have mixed feelings, but I feel like for whatever reason, I’m here, and I’m going to make my setting as inclusive as possible.” I worked on what I felt was best for my students at my particular school, all the while trying to learn more and more strategies on how to affect the larger system. You know what I mean?

Amanda Morin:
Yeah, I do. And I think it’s important to know that it’s not an all-or-nothing proposition. It’s not “we’re all inclusive” or “not inclusive.” You can affect your piece of the world, and that makes a big impact. It’s like a ripple effect.

I know that sounds very Pollyanna, but it’s really true. It’s always amazing to me to see communities like ours—the inclusive community—where just knowing each other, even if it’s online, we all sort of pick up the thread and make a difference in our teaching, with parents, and with other teachers. That little difference can really grow into a big movement. And just because you can’t see that the movement is coming doesn’t mean you’re not building toward it.

Tim Villegas:
Right. Well, I certainly hope that what we’re doing is making a difference. I believe that. It’s my job to believe.

Well, I just want to make sure everyone knows where they can find you—your tweets, your Facebook, and your writing. Can you give us your details?

Amanda Morin:
Sure. I’m really easy to find. I’m @AmandaMorin on Twitter—that’s M-O-R-I-N. On Facebook, I’m Amanda Morin, Author and Consultant, which is a big fancy way of saying it’s my professional page. I think it’s facebook.com/amandamorinteacher if you’re looking for it.

I have all sorts of other social media that I’m really lax in using, so I probably shouldn’t promote it. But I’m pretty active on Twitter. And I do a lot of writing and blogging at Understood.org. I’m always writing about my experiences and putting new things out there, and that’s easy to find too.

Tim Villegas:
Yes. And for those of you who don’t know or aren’t familiar with Understood.org, it’s fantastic—the resources that are on there, including video, which can be more engaging for some people. It’s just a really excellent warehouse of resources.

Amanda Morin:
It has built-in accessibility tools too, which I always feel is important to mention. It’s built for you if you’re accessing information differently. I’m very proud of that. I think it’s important.

Tim Villegas:
Fantastic. Well, I’d like to thank Amanda Morin for being on the Think Inclusive Podcast. Thank you for your time.

Amanda Morin:
Thank you for having me on.

Tim Villegas:
That is our show. We’d like to thank Amanda Morin for being a guest on the Think Inclusive Podcast. Make sure to follow her on Twitter and Facebook, and look for her work on Understood.org.

Follow Think Inclusive on the web at thinkinclusive.us, as well as on Twitter, Facebook, Google+, and Instagram.

Today’s show was produced by myself using an SM58 USB Logitech headset, Zoom H1 Handy Recorder, MacBook Pro, GarageBand, and a Skype account.

You can also subscribe to the Think Inclusive Podcast via Apple Podcasts, Google Play, Stitcher, or Anchor.fm—the easiest way to start a podcast.

From Marietta, Georgia, please join us again on the Think Inclusive Podcast. Thanks for your time and attention.