Show Notes
About the Guest(s)
Jackie Mader is a seasoned journalist with The Hechinger Report, a nonprofit education news outlet. With rich experience in special education, Jackie draws from her background as a teacher in Charlotte, North Carolina, combined with years of in-depth research into the challenges and advancements within teacher preparation for inclusive education settings.
Christina Samuels serves as an Associate Editor at Education Week, having covered special education since 2004. With a background in education reporting from her work with the Washington Post, Christina blends her extensive experience and insights into special education and early childhood education, seeking solutions to systemic challenges within educational systems.
Episode Summary
The Think Inclusive Podcast, hosted by Tim Villegas, dives into the pressing challenges faced by educators when teaching in inclusive classrooms. In this episode, education journalists Jackie Mader and Christina Samuels offer their unique perspectives on the preparedness of general education teachers to support students with disabilities. Through recounting field studies and personal experiences, Jackie Mader highlights how some teacher preparation programs strive for better inclusivity and the ongoing obstacles they confront.
This episode sheds light on the ongoing national shortfall of special education teachers, as discussed by Christina Samuels. She explores the reasons behind the persistent shortage and potential solutions, including the role of co-teaching and more inclusive training for general educators. Their discussions highlight educators’ struggles, legal obligations, pedagogical challenges, and a crucial need to elevate expectations and practices in inclusive education
Read the transcript (auto-generated and edited with help from AI for readability)
Tim Villegas: Ask nearly any general education teacher about teaching students with disabilities. There is one typical response: “I didn’t go to school to work with those kids.” In 2017, The Hechinger Report published a story about how some educators feel unprepared to teach in classrooms where students with and without disabilities learn together.
Part of the story focused on Mary, a teacher from Bloomfield, New Jersey. When she was first starting out in the classroom, she had no idea how to handle students who had learning disabilities or challenging behavior. Over time, Mary developed strategies like how to talk students down from the ledge who were struggling with big emotions. She also learned how to keep students with disabilities on task by chunking larger pieces of information into smaller ones. Although she earned a bachelor’s degree and a teaching credential in math, no one taught her these strategies. She was left to figure it out on her own.
I wanted to know more about this story, so I invited Jackie Mader, the journalist from The Hechinger Report who wrote the article, to talk to me about why this issue was so important to her.
Jackie Mader: I’m Jackie Mader. I write for The Hechinger Report, which is a nonprofit education news outlet. Coming from my own teacher prep program, knowing how little I was prepared to work with students with disabilities, and then my first classroom job was as a special education teacher. I taught in Charlotte, North Carolina, and once I entered the classroom, I was doing a mix of pull-out and push-in inclusion. A lot of the other teachers I worked with had this mentality of, “Those are your kids and the rest of the kids are my kids.”
When I stopped teaching and became a journalist, I always remembered that and thought about it. So when I was covering teacher preparation, I really wanted to do a story on how well general ed teachers are prepared to work with students with disabilities. By that time, inclusion was becoming more common.
I started my research for that article by finding a teacher prep program that was trying to do this really well—trying to prepare all of their teachers to teach in an inclusive setting. I found two programs doing a good job of that. One was Montclair in New Jersey, and that was who I focused on for this article. I visited a school district that was working with Montclair and was pulling some of their graduates into their schools in an attempt to not only make more inclusive classrooms but have teachers who could better teach all the students in their classrooms.
It was really interesting talking to the teachers when I visited their inclusive classrooms. They were very open about the fact that they didn’t come in prepared. They said, “I didn’t really know how to teach students with disabilities. We didn’t cover that in teacher prep.” Or, “I had one class called Special Ed 101,” and a lot of times it covered some of the major disabilities and how they might manifest in the classroom, but it didn’t go into detail about how to teach in an inclusive setting or how the same disability can manifest in different ways.
These teachers were really upfront about wishing they were better prepared because they got into classrooms and had no idea what to do when met with different student needs, especially disabilities that impacted classroom management. Teachers said they especially struggled to work with students with behavioral disabilities and really wished their teacher preparation program had prepared them more.
Tim Villegas: What do you feel is the national trend toward the prep programs?
Jackie Mader: I haven’t heard as much about teacher prep programs trying to change and become more inclusive. I’ve heard more about schools or school districts saying, “We’re going to make this a priority and move toward inclusion,” partly because in many cases, they’re legally required to and just haven’t been for many reasons. But also, yes, there is a lot of data—more recent data—that shows inclusive practice is beneficial for all students. That is starting to really get into classrooms and schools, and administrators and teachers are hearing about that faster than teacher prep programs are changing.
Tim Villegas: What has been the strategy for school districts and schools that want to move toward more inclusive practices?
Jackie Mader: The most recent article I did about a district taking the reins was a story about inclusive practices in public preschool programs in a district in Arizona. They ramped up their special education department, hired more people to consult with schools, and made sure they had experts available to help run great inclusive preschool classrooms. They also shifted funding around to pay for more teachers to staff these classrooms.
They really made it a priority. When I talked to them, I kept asking, “How are you doing this?” And they kept saying, “We’ve made this a priority. We’ve educated all of our teachers on how important this is. We’ve shared the data on how inclusion benefits all students. We’ve educated our teachers, parents, and school leaders.” They shifted money around and went full force into it. That seems to be the best strategy.
My colleague and I did a big investigation on high school graduation rates for students with disabilities. We interviewed 45 or 50 students and families across the country and heard stories of students’ entire education careers. A common theme was very low expectations for students with disabilities.
I called a principal to get his point of view on a student who had graduated from his school. She had dyslexia and maybe another disability, but nothing that would preclude her from being in general education classes. She had been pulled out and put in a special elective class just for students with disabilities where they did things like build cars out of milk containers. I asked why she was immediately put in that class, and he said, “All of our students with disabilities go in that class. If we see it doesn’t work for them, then we take them out.”
That seemed so backwards. The expectation was low: “We’ll put you in this lower class, and if you prove you don’t need to be here, then we’ll pull you out.” Instead of, “We’ll put you with your peers first, and if it’s not working, we’ll support you.” That mindset is really concerning and unfortunately prevalent. It gets in the way of inclusion.
Tim Villegas: You can find more from The Hechinger Report at hechingerreport.org and follow Jackie on Twitter at Jackie Mader. Today on the podcast, I interview Christina Samuels of Education Week. We discuss Ed Week’s special report called Special Education Practice and Pitfalls, which takes a look at the shortage of special education teachers, how co-teaching strategies enhance the effectiveness of education for all students, and how to encourage parents and students to advocate for their needs.
After a short break…
Christina Samuels: This is Christina Samuels, and you’re listening to the Think Inclusive Podcast.
Tim Villegas: Hi Christina, thanks for being on the podcast today.
Christina Samuels: Thank you for inviting me.
Tim Villegas: So you are an associate editor with Ed Week, is that correct?
Christina Samuels: That’s it. Yep, I’ve been covering special education since 2004.
Tim Villegas: That’s quite a long time.
Christina Samuels: Yes, it feels like a long time sometimes.
Tim Villegas: Right, yeah. I started classroom teaching in 2003. So I’ve been working for a public school system for 15 years. And you’ve been covering education for about that long. So I understand how long that feels.
Christina Samuels: Yes. One of my first stories was, in fact, the first story that I wrote when I started at Education Week was talking about the reauthorization of IDEA. I didn’t know at that time that we might not see another reauthorization for several more years, but that was where I started. Quite a lot has happened since then, and unfortunately, some things have stayed the same. But it’s been a great beat to cover.
Tim Villegas: Excellent. And I know this isn’t one of our pre-planned questions, but what is your connection to education? Why did you want to cover this particular beat?
Christina Samuels: Sure. I actually started off covering education at The Washington Post. I was a school beat reporter, so I covered Prince William County schools in Northern Virginia. I started when the previous reporter went on maternity leave. They needed someone to take over the beat, and I was available, so I started covering education then and just kept up with it. It’s been fascinating. When I was in Northern Virginia, there was a lot happening around standards-based education, and the school district was diversifying rapidly. There was never any lack of stories, so I consider education to be a great beat.
I didn’t cover special education specifically then—I covered anything happening in the district. But when I came to Education Week, they needed a special education reporter, so I launched into that specialty. I also cover early childhood education. There’s an interesting overlap between special education and early childhood, especially when talking about early intervention services and early identification.
Tim Villegas: In Education Week’s publication, you have an article about the shortage of special educators. What do you think is the primary reason why we have a shortage of special educators in the United States?
Christina Samuels: Thanks for asking about this. This was part of a special report we did that came out earlier in December. We looked at many elements of special education, and one of the stories I focused on was the special education teacher shortage.
One thing I learned is that this shortage has probably been around as long as special education has existed as a legal entity. There’s always been a shortage of people interested in pursuing what can be a challenging—though rewarding—job, especially when there are other positions in education.
There are a couple of things happening. One is the overall shortage of people interested in going into teaching. This is primarily driven by women choosing other career paths. Then, special education itself is harder to fill because people don’t know much about what it means. Some universities ask students interested in majoring in special education what got them into it, and often it’s a personal experience—either with a family member or something that happened in school—that led them into the profession.
You’d think we’d see more of that now, with inclusion being a common practice, but I still think there’s a limited number of people with that personal experience. That can be a factor. But honestly, there are a variety of things going on. A lack of information or ignorance about people with disabilities, a sense that the job is hard and involves a lot of paperwork—all of these contribute to the shortage.
Tim Villegas: Do you think it makes it even more difficult that we have these two separate systems?
Christina Samuels: I definitely wonder. This is a question for decision-makers, but I wonder whether we need to give general education teachers more training in how to differentiate instruction for kids on the mild to moderate end of the disability spectrum. These kids are in general education classrooms with general education teachers, and those teachers can’t realistically say, “This is someone else’s job.” It’s their job.
I think they know that, but there’s fear and trepidation about what that means. If people felt more confident in their training, it wouldn’t be as worrisome. The bottom line is, there aren’t enough special education teachers for all the kids with disabilities. But they still need a free and appropriate public education. So what are you going to do?
I feel like this is a question for teacher training programs to grapple with: What do we want our general education teachers to know? I don’t see anything on the horizon that’s going to close the gap between the number of special education teachers we have and the number we need. The problem has persisted for so long, it’s unlikely something will make a big difference. So we need to rethink the whole question: Who should be responsible for providing that education, and what do they need to know?
Tim Villegas: In your research, did you see any trends from schools or school districts on how they’re using special educators—whether it’s more of a support role or a direct instruction role with co-teaching? Was there any trend that you saw?
Christina Samuels: This is something we’ve covered. There’s definitely a trend toward co-teaching and team teaching. Some of these partnerships are extraordinarily successful, with professionals working together quite well. Others are not done as well.
I think school leaders may look at co-teaching as a way to provide the differentiated instruction required in a student’s IEP. But they really have to be thoughtful about it—thoughtful in giving teachers enough time to plan together, work together, and think through things like whose name is on the report card, where the teacher sits, who is responsible, and who interacts with the parents. These kinds of things need to be thought through carefully.
All that to say, I do see a larger trend toward co-teaching, but I think anyone in a co-teaching partnership would probably say this is not just some sort of slam-dunk solution. It requires its own level of expertise on both sides to do well.
Tim Villegas: Are you surprised that some school districts and schools do not offer co-teaching services?
Christina Samuels: I wouldn’t say I’m surprised. One thing I can say from doing this for a while is that I’m not surprised by too much. But I will say, for people who are not doing this, I do wonder—what are they doing?
This is definitely worth further stories, and I hope to get a chance to do those. It’s one thing to say there’s a shortage—we know about the shortage. So what are you doing? The students are there. They have a legal entitlement to certain educational supports and accommodations. What’s happening? Who’s doing that? Is that getting done?
One thing we didn’t explore in this particular special report, but that we saw, was a real rise in the number of paraprofessionals in school districts. So what does that mean? I can’t tell you right now, but I think that’s a question that needs to be asked. What does it mean to have a decline in special education teachers and a marked increase in paraprofessionals? What are they doing? What kind of training are they getting? What kind of services are they providing in the classroom? Lots of questions to be answered there.
Tim Villegas: Christina, I loved how Ed Week included student and family voices in this publication, and that it wasn’t just from the educator’s perspective or even from the researcher’s perspective. What do you think we could learn from students and families that educators serve?
Christina Samuels: I was really happy we got a chance to include those students. What was interesting—and this is just a side note—is that a lot of those students had just submitted things to us. So I think one thing to think about is that sometimes we’re not aware, or maybe don’t understand, that kids can have a really sophisticated understanding of their own needs and challenges, and what supports they need.
Of course, this isn’t the same for every child at every age or with every disability. There are as many different interactions as there are students. But one thing that came across with the teens we had in this report was that they really felt like they weren’t being listened to. They felt like they were trying to say what they needed and weren’t being heard.
What I take away from that is a couple of things. One is that we should teach kids how to advocate for themselves. Sometimes they might not have the language to describe what they’re going through. The kids in our report were particularly eloquent and able to describe their situations well. Other students may need help with that, and that’s okay. That kind of self-advocacy will serve them well as adults—being able to identify what they need to be successful and go after it.
The other thing is listening to them more. Some students felt—even with disabilities that people think they understand—like they weren’t being understood. We had a student with a visual impairment, and you’d think that’s a disability people get. She can’t see well. But she still felt like people didn’t understand what she needed. You can’t gesture toward her, make a face, or use nonverbal communication—she can’t see it. When she didn’t respond to it, people thought she had communication problems. That wasn’t her problem. Her problem was that she couldn’t see what was going on.
So I think teaching kids to speak up for themselves and listening when they do are the things I took away from the student contributors to this special report.
Tim Villegas: Christina, what do you think is the biggest barrier to inclusion for students with disabilities?
Christina Samuels: Ooh, that’s a big question. I wouldn’t presume—as I’m not an educator—to say I could speak to the biggest barriers. But one that continually comes up is a lack of understanding of what students can do.
Sometimes this doesn’t come from a bad place. It’s easy to say, “Teachers just don’t believe in these kids,” and that’s not only incorrect, it’s unfair. Many teachers are very adept at understanding what kids need. But sometimes there’s a desire to ask, “Is this too hard for this person? Are we making their life harder? Is this kid going to leave school with a regular diploma? If not, why are we going through this exercise of inclusive learning?”
Let me be clear—I hear this from parents as well. This isn’t just something that falls on teachers or administrators. I think there needs to be real conversations about what we think this kid can do, what they want to do, and what our hopes and goals are. Providing that support is easier said than done, but I think those barriers often stem from expectations—or a lack of them.
Tim Villegas: If you would like to hear the entire unedited recording of my interview with Jackie Mader from The Hechinger Report or Christina Samuels from Education Week, consider becoming a Patreon subscriber at patreon.com/ThinkInclusivePodcast. Follow the Think Inclusive Podcast on the web at thinkinclusive.us. Tell us what you thought of the podcast via Twitter at inclusive_pod, or find us on Facebook or Instagram.
You can also subscribe to the Think Inclusive Podcast via Apple Podcasts, Google Play, Stitcher, or on the Anchor app. We love to know that you’re listening. Also, a reminder that you can support the Think Inclusive Podcast via Patreon or anchor.fm with a monthly contribution so that we can continue to bring you in-depth interviews with thought leaders in inclusive education and community advocacy.
On that note, thank you to Patreons Donna L, Kathleen T, and Veronica E for their continued support of the podcast, as well as our new $1-a-month Patreons. Every little bit helps. Also, a special shout-out to my producer and love of my life, Brianna. You will always be my Alex. Thanks to my boys—you know who you are—for your feedback and suggestions. It is greatly appreciated.
It’s not much of a tale, but I’m sort of attached to it.
Next time on the Think Inclusive Podcast…
Juanita Pritchard: Usually my experience with intellectual disabilities in a general education classroom, the teachers don’t understand how it can look different for that student, but they want somehow to make it the same as everybody else.
Tim Villegas: Thanks for your time and attention. See you next time.
Kids: This has been a production of Think Inclusive LLC.
Key Takeaways
- Many general education teachers feel unprepared to teach students with disabilities due to insufficient inclusive education training in their preparation programs.
- Inclusion benefits all students; however, there are systemic and mindset barriers that need to be addressed for successful integration into general education classrooms.
- Strategies like co-teaching require quality planning and training to be effective, addressing various student needs, and must involve both special and general educators equally.
- National trends toward inclusion are often overshadowed by the persistent shortage of special education teachers, emphasizing the need for systemic changes in teacher recruitment and training.
- Students with disabilities highlight the importance of self-advocacy and being heard, illustrating a need for educators and systems to genuinely listen and respond to student needs.
Resources
The Hechinger Report: hechingerreport.org
Education Week: edweek.org