Building Inclusive Communities Beyond Schools with Merge Consulting ~ 916

Tim Villegas:
Friendships are important for everyone. And so I want you to think about a good friend that you have. Go ahead, take a second. And once you have that person in your mind, ask yourself, where did I meet this friend? Was it at school? Was it at your place of worship? Was it at your job? Or is your friend your neighbor? You see, chances are you met your friend where you spend a lot of your time—the physical and sometimes virtual spaces that you are. And for people with disabilities, especially those with extensive support needs, the spaces for them… well, let’s be honest, they’re limited.

But our guest today, Lisa Drennan, the founder of Merge Consulting, has a great idea that goes beyond making schools inclusive. She asks: What if we can make community inclusive—specifically recreational organizations like YMCAs, community rec programs, and libraries? Those organizations that are supposed to serve all people.

My name is Tim Villegas and you are listening to the Think Inclusive Podcast presented by MCIE.

Tim Villegas:
This podcast exists to build bridges between families, educators, and disability rights advocates to create a shared understanding of inclusive education and what inclusion looks like in the real world. To find out more about who we are and what we do, check us out at thinkinclusive.us, or on the socials—Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter.

Today on the podcast, I interview Lisa Drennan, inclusion expert, founder of Merge Consulting. We discuss how families of children with disabilities can advocate to join community recreation groups like the YMCA or even a local summer camp. And the strategies for advocating for change in recreation spaces are not that different from what we use for schools.

But before we jump into our interview with Lisa, I wanted to share a story from a publication that Lisa talks about near the end of our interview. It is called Building Friendships Between People With and People Without Disabilities: A Toolkit for Community Recreation, Cultural, and Faith Organizations.

Tim Villegas:
I picked this particular story because it shows the power of friendships when students with extensive support needs are included in general education classrooms. But there are other examples throughout the toolkit.

The story of Jesse and his friends. Jesse had friends—friends like Jamie and Kyle, Adam, and Kelman. Friends who would come over to his house to go swimming, listen to music together, and partake in the shenanigans that go along with a sleepover.

Jamie Becker met Jesse when they were in seventh grade science class together. She started talking to him, and even though he was nonverbal, they did not have trouble understanding each other. “I felt like I could communicate with him by not even saying a word. We just got each other,” shares Jamie, as she recounts the first day meeting him. In fact, later that year Jamie’s teacher had to move her seat because she was always talking too much to Jesse.

Tim Villegas:
It was not too long before Jamie and Jesse started hanging out together outside of school. “I would bring Jesse a newly burnt CD of all the music I liked, and we would get a kick out of listening to them together,” Jamie shared. “A favorite memory with Jesse was when we (Jesse and their friend, Kyle) got dressed up for Halloween and handed out candy to the neighborhood kids. Afterward, we watched scary movies together. It was so much fun.”

Jamie’s recollection of how she shared with her parents about meeting a new friend was similar to that of Adam, a friend from elementary school who is described by Jesse’s mother Maryanne in her memoir Knowing Jesse. He made friends, too: Adam and Kelman, neither one the sensitive type you’d think would be attracted to a nonverbal kid in a wheelchair. Adam told his mother there was a kid in his class who hated to color as much as he did.

Tim Villegas:
And could they have him over for a visit? A few weeks later he asked his mom, “What does nonverbal mean?” His mother told him. Adam was puzzled, “But Jesse can talk. People just don’t listen.” Adam’s mom was shocked when she met Jesse. Adam hadn’t mentioned the wheelchair. It just wasn’t important to him, as was the mutual hatred of coloring.

When Jesse came over to visit, Adam and his brother, Derek, included him in their boisterous games—Jesse shrieking with laughter as they maneuvered his wheelchair in a dizzying game of tag. Later, they became bowling buddies one day a week at the local lanes—Jesse pushing the ball down a chute that fit over his wheelchair, Adam carefully positioning the chute. Their team was called the Outlaws.

Jamie and Jesse’s friendship continued into high school. At the end of middle school, they attended the traditional and ceremonial eighth-grade semi-formal dance together.

Tim Villegas:
She recalls this as one of the fondest memories she has of her middle school years—a time which so many often wish to erase, but somehow made better for her because of her friendship with Jesse. Unfortunately, prior to their freshman year, their school went through a redistricting change resulting in Jamie having to attend a different high school than Jesse. Jamie recalls being so devastated by this change, she asked her parents to purchase a house in Jesse’s town so they could still be in school together.

School and life went on, and they still kept in touch and spent time together outside of school. Sadly, the following year, Jesse passed away. “I had a true connection with Jesse that I’ve never experienced with anyone else to this day,” she recounts sadly. “Jesse was so handsome. He had a great sense of humor. He was smart. He was caring, and he had a beautiful soul. And now, years later, I can honestly say that I’ve never had a friend quite like Jesse.”

Thanks to Lisa Drennan for giving us permission to share a story from the Building Friendships toolkit. Thanks for listening, subscribing, and rating us on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And now our interview with Lisa Drennan.

Tim Villegas:
Today on the podcast, we welcome Lisa Drennan, who is an inclusion expert, trainer, consultant, and speaker. She’s the founder of Merge Inclusion Consulting, where she uses her 37 years of leadership and experience in supporting people with disabilities to build more inclusive communities where everyone has a valued and meaningful role. Lisa Drennan, welcome to the Think Inclusive Podcast.

Lisa Drennan:
Thanks, Tim. Thanks for having me. I’m so glad to be here and having this conversation with you. I’m really excited.

Tim Villegas:
Would you introduce yourself to our audience and tell us a little bit about Merge Inclusion Consulting?

Lisa Drennan:
Absolutely. And my story goes way back to the—cough, cough—early eighties, when I started working in the field. I was working at a local organization called New England Village. This was a residential community for adults with IDD—intellectual and developmental disabilities. At the time our title was “staff”; now it’s direct support professionals.

I worked my way up while working there, and I spent 30 years in my career there, working up to be a manager of a house and further up. I became very interested in recreation. I found that that was a space where the men and women we were supporting—I could see them shine. I could see somebody jump into an art class and discover a new talent they didn’t know they had, or hop into Zumba class with some friends and be having a great time together.

Lisa Drennan:
So that became a space that I was very comfortable in and wanted to expand upon. I became the recreation director, and then we built on the campus. It’s a campus-style setting in Pembroke, Massachusetts—that’s where I’m from. We built a wellness center right on the campus. We had aquatics and fitness and music and art.

At the time the primary focus was to be an amenity for the men and women who lived there—very specialized, or one might say segregated. This wellness center was originally built for them. In the building process, that’s where I was introduced to the whole process of universal design—building and creating, hiring staff whom I would teach how to teach to this population to make sure that they’re engaged and everybody’s having meaningful participation. It was a wonderful experience for me.

Lisa Drennan:
I moved on to be the association director of inclusion at my own YMCA. I was a member there, and they had a position. I thought, this would be interesting—working outside of this community.

What happened there: I started working and I had this huge aha moment—literally could have hit me over with a ton of bricks—because it was so eye-opening. I realized I had been spending 30 years helping folks who worked with this population, and everyone engaged in helping this population to be engaged and to get out into the community. Particularly where it was a residential setting that was more of a campus, we worked to make sure folks were out in the community.

Now I’m working with camp counselors, or a yoga instructor, lifeguards, membership staff at the front desk—teaching them how to welcome, engage, and include community members with diverse abilities into their existing programming.

Lisa Drennan:
And the huge aha was: if we don’t teach the rest of the world how to do this, no wonder in the previous 30 years it always felt like we were on a treadmill—constantly trying to help our folks be engaged out in the community, to attend church, to join a dance team or horseback riding lessons, or whatever was of interest to them. It always felt like a treadmill. You’d try something, and maybe the staff who was wonderful left, and then you’d have to start all over.

It dawned on me that there’s a huge need—what I call the other side of the bridge.

Lisa Drennan:
So there are individuals with disabilities, their staff, their family on one side of the bridge. And then the other side of the bridge is the community. We really have to help the community become more comfortable and give them the tools and confidence to be welcoming, engaging, and supportive.

It made me think: I want to do this more. I’d like to help other communities. I loved helping my Y community and learning about Ys, and I did help other Ys across the country. I led a resource group—it was called DOG: Diverse Abilities Working Group—for Ys across the country. It energized me to have someone call me from Texas or Florida or California and say, “Hey, how do you do this, Lisa? What would we do here?” I did so much of that, I thought: this is what I want to do.

Lisa Drennan:
So I made the decision to start Merge. My original intent was to focus on recreation, sport, and camp organizations and help them become more inclusive—but really any community organization: churches, libraries, clubs, even first responders. Anyone who offers something for the community.

That was in 2018. About a year and a half in, I realized that a lot of the human service providers I used to work with—or had connected with for the Y—were reaching out and saying, “Hey, can you come do a training here?” or “Could you come talk to our families? Our families feel stuck trying to help their child access an inclusive camp,” or an adult son or daughter participate in something in the community.

So I added another arm to my offerings. I work with human service providers or any agency that supports folks with disabilities. I kind of have those two arms, which is perfect. That’s the bridge we need to build, and the bridge needs to be strengthened from both sides constantly. I’ve had this really awesome and unique background and experience that makes what I do not even feel like work. This is my mission in life. This is what I was meant to do, and I’ve found the perfect setting to help others in the community.

Tim Villegas:
So, let’s say there’s a family who wants their son or daughter with Down syndrome to be at their local YMCA for whatever program they’re offering. And that YMCA says, “We just don’t know how to do this. We don’t know how to include.” Or maybe they say they’d like to, but they don’t really want to. What does that family do? Some of our listeners are in that position as they look to the summer—camps and stuff like that.

Lisa Drennan:
Absolutely. I get a lot of inquiries from families. Here’s where I’d start: begin at the top. If it’s a YMCA, go to your local branch and ask to speak to the associate director—the person in charge. Start with a very welcoming and collaborative conversation, as opposed to, “Maybe you don’t have this, and ADA requires this.” Perhaps don’t start with that approach—be really welcoming.

If there’s a “no” or “we don’t do that” or “we’re not equipped,” it usually comes from the ground level: the aquatic instructor, the person who teaches a particular offering, or the camp director. “Oh, no, we can’t take…”—that language usually comes from that level.

So go to the top and ask about their barriers. In most cases it’s a lack of education, training, or confidence that they can include kids with disabilities. Start there, and perhaps suggest an inclusion training. Find out what their barriers are, and help them start breaking those down.

Lisa Drennan:
I also think it’s important to ask local providers—maybe an Arc chapter or another human service provider—what other programs in the area are more inclusive. I say this twofold. It’s important to know who else is doing inclusion well—not to jump ship and drive 20 extra miles for a swim class, but to understand what’s possible. Sometimes saying, “I know the Y down here is doing something; maybe you could talk with them,” helps.

There has to be a lot of collaboration, which I find almost all Ys are open to, because they don’t want assimilation—one Y getting overpopulated with too many kids with disabilities, which disrupts a natural balance. We want to avoid assimilation by giving every Y or rec program—JCCs, Boys & Girls Clubs—the tools to include.

Tim Villegas:
Can you tell us what that acronym means?

Lisa Drennan:
Sure. JCC is a Jewish Community Center, and then Boys & Girls Clubs as well. These are organizations that provide recreation—maybe after-school programming, camps, things of that nature. JCCs are across the country and are very committed to inclusion. It’s part of their faith and mission to be open and welcoming to kids with disabilities.

Tim Villegas:
I’m hearing a lot of similarities in strategies for community inclusion and schools. One thing I heard was “go to the top.” Even if you make a little change on the ground level, for change to be long-lasting it needs to come from a director or associate director—someone with the power to make change in that organization. Is that what I’m hearing?

Lisa Drennan:
Absolutely. Inclusion isn’t a program. It’s not a staff member. It’s not an event. Inclusion is the organizational commitment, and that has to start from the top down. Sometimes I come in at the mid level or the bottom level—someone is really excited after a training and wants to build more inclusion in their camp. Without that top-level support, it’s not going to be sustainable.

Whoever’s at the top—this has to become part of their mission. Eventually we want to transition for it to be culture—not a program, not a staff member. Often we hear: “Oh, we’re inclusive. We have that special needs program,” or “We’re inclusive. We have that staff—she’s a para during the school year, so she’s really good with those kids.” Those might be part of the formula, but they’re not inclusion. There’s a lot of teaching to do.

Lisa Drennan:
And many people I train are 16–18-year-old camp counselors. They don’t have this background. It’s wonderful—I’d a hundred times over rather train a group of camp counselors than a group of teachers who’ve been in their positions for 20–30 years, because they can be rigid or set in their ways. I love working with camps because once they invite me in, they’re in that position: they want to do better; they just don’t know how—what does that look like?

Tim Villegas:
Another point you made: find other organizations that are including individuals with disabilities. “The Y 20 minutes away is doing it—maybe talk to them.” That’s a strategy schools can use, too: “The district across the way is including students with autism or intellectual disabilities—maybe you could visit or talk to them.”

Lisa Drennan:
Absolutely. For rec programs, camps, sport organizations, it can be hard to envision inclusion because they haven’t seen it in their setting. “We don’t have ‘special needs’ kids in our aquatics program, so we don’t do that.” They haven’t seen that it’s possible. When you see it’s possible, the guards go down and the barriers melt away.

The immediate focus often becomes, “What could go wrong?”—What if this happens? Our minds go there. One of my principles of inclusion is: Let’s get to yes. Instead of, “What if kids with autism have behaviors?”—well, what if any kid does that? That’s what kids do. There are so many fears based on stigma or secondhand stories.

Lisa Drennan:
When presented with, “We have a seven-year-old—Sarah—joining your group next week. She has Down syndrome and a hearing impairment; let me tell you about her,” the immediate response from many people is, “I can’t do this,” followed by reasons why. I suggest: take a deep breath and switch your focus. When you’re presented with that, instead of thinking why you can’t, start thinking, How are we going to make this happen? How do we get to yes?

If COVID showed us one thing, it’s that we’ve learned flexibility, resilience, creativity. We can make it work. Put our brains together and figure it out as a team: the camp director, the counselor who’ll work directly with Sarah, Sarah herself—what will help make camp successful for her?—her parent, maybe a teacher, maybe a counselor from another inclusive camp. The team comes up with strategies and supports to ensure Sarah has a successful time at camp. We’re aiming for a mindset shift.

Tim Villegas:
Why is inclusion in community organizations important, and why has it been important for you in your work with Merge?

Lisa Drennan:
If you think about community organizations or recreation programs of any type—churches, places where you practice your faith—what draws me is that it’s where people choose to be. That’s important. It’s also where somebody can shine.

Schools and work settings often have measurements or standards people must reach, which creates separation or labels—levels and tiers. In recreation, you go to have fun, and everyone is capable of having fun. Everyone is capable of being on that team, taking an art class, joining a camp, and having a blast. Recreation is a space where everyone should belong, and it’s where somebody’s going to shine.

You get to choose: What are you going to do this summer? If you had free time and wanted to try something new, you’d pick something you like to do. The good thing is, you’ll be with other people who also want to be in that group or class—people with similar interests. Now you’re opening up a social relationship opportunity that may not happen as easily in other settings. You both like this—something to talk about and expand upon.

Tim Villegas:
I understand you produced a toolkit with The Arc of Massachusetts around friendship and community inclusion. Tell our listeners about that.

Lisa Drennan:
Yes. I was the primary author on this toolkit. The Arc of Massachusetts has a program called Widening the Circle, which includes the Pathways to Friendship project—an initiative on social inclusion. When I met this group, I learned about a series of books they have: friendships where you live, where you learn, where you work, and where you play. They had already been created with trainings that go along with them. The audience was family members, educators, individuals with disabilities, and direct support professionals.

Then they heard about my work. We had the same aha moment as with the Y: we have to teach the rest of the world, or we’ll constantly be on this treadmill. They had written these four books for family members, DSPs, and people with disabilities, but there was nothing for the rest of the world. They asked me to create the fifth toolkit.

It’s called Building Friendships Between People With and Without Disabilities: A Toolkit for Community Recreation, Cultural, and Faith Organizations. This is a tool for the instructor at a Y, the person who runs a camp, someone who works in a library, Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts—written for the “other side of the bridge.”

Lisa Drennan:
All my work starts by considering the audience and breaking it down into bite-size pieces. There’s not a lot of “this study, that study.” I share how to become more inclusive, how to think about inclusion, what it really means, some of the barriers you’ve hit or will likely hit, and suggestions to overcome them. That’s the first section.

The next section introduces a new idea: you could have a tremendous role connecting one person with another—one with a disability, one without—who share a common interest (theater, Pokémon, NASCAR, swimming, whatever it is). The instructor, coach, or group leader recognizes that and helps prompt—not force—those seeds of potential friendship.

There are tips on barriers at three levels: organizational, the individual with disabilities and family, and the rest of the community attendees. For each, it covers barriers and suggested ways to overcome them.

Lisa Drennan:
I also wanted to show what’s possible. I found five friendship pairs—one person had a disability, one did not—who met or whose friendship evolved through a recreational activity. We’re looking at mutual, reciprocal friendships born of shared participation—some are 30 years, 10 years, five years. I interviewed them and included them in the book. If people can see that a person with a disability can and should have friends—whether or not those friends have disabilities—we open that up by showing it’s possible.

The toolkit is a wonderful tool. Earlier you asked what a parent can do if they hit a roadblock—this toolkit can be an incredible tool to hand to someone and say, “This might be worth a look.”

Tim Villegas:
It’s a fantastic resource. Where can people find the toolkit?

Lisa Drennan:
Fantastic. All five toolkits are at thearcofmass.org/friendship. You’ll find the four earlier books (friendships where you live, learn, work, and play) and the fifth toolkit for a different audience. It’s a tool for family members, DSPs, or a person with a disability to hand to an organization. You can download versions, and if you live in Massachusetts, they’ll mail it out to you. I’m so happy with this work and the community’s response: “This is needed.” Having these conversations about friendships matters, because when you have a reciprocal, mutual friendship—not, “Can you volunteer to be their friend?”—you get authentic relationships. That’s what we’re looking for.

Tim Villegas:
Will you share how people can find you—socials, website, email?

Lisa Drennan:
Absolutely. First, my site: mergeconsulting.org. There you can subscribe to my monthly newsletter—that’s a great way to stay in touch and see what’s coming up. I’d also love folks to connect on social media: Facebook (Merge Inclusion Consulting), LinkedIn (Lisa Drennan), and Instagram (@mergeinclusion). You can also reach me via email at LisaDrennan@mergeconsulting.org.

Tim Villegas:
Lisa Drennan, thank you so much for being on the Think Inclusive Podcast. We appreciate your time.

Lisa Drennan:
Pleasure to be here. Thank you for the opportunity to raise up this important conversation.

Tim Villegas:
That will do it for this episode of the Think Inclusive Podcast. Subscribe via Apple Podcasts, the Anchor app, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Have a question or comment? Email your feedback at podcast@thinkinclusive.us. We love to know that you’re listening.

Thank you to patrons Veronica E, Sonya A, Pamela P, Mark C, Kathy B, Kathleen T, and Jared T for their continued support of the podcast. When you become a patron, your contribution helps with the cost of audio production, transcription, and promotion of the Think Inclusive Podcast—and you could even get a shout out like the fine people we just mentioned. Go to patreon.com/thinkinclusivepodcast to become a patron today and get access to all our unedited interviews, including the conversation you heard today.

Thank you for helping us equip more people to promote and sustain inclusive education. This podcast is a production of MCIE, where we envision a society where neighborhood schools welcome all learners and create the foundation for inclusive communities. Learn more at mcie.org. We will be back with another Think Inclusive episode in a couple of weeks, and look out for more editions of the Weeklyish and bonus episodes in the meantime.

Thanks for your time and attention and for listening. Until next time, remember: inclusion always works.